Vivi: [00:00:00] cured your depression. Yes. Really?

Erick: it’s a saying. Oh, . I thought actually, I was like, whoa. That’s crazy. That’s the power of music. it like literally touched you

Back to Chicken Out. Scared here with you as always, Eric Mvv. Today we’re talking about the 2021 film Candy Man directed by Ania DeCosta. But before we get into that, how are you Vivi?

Vivi: It’s our kind of two year anniversary, kind of today. The exact

Erick: date as of recording this March 2nd is our anniversary.

Yay. So congrats and congrats to you guys for listening to us.

Vivi: Yeah, it’s been a really fast two years.

Erick: the last maybe half year has been like a blur. Obviously we’re not doing exactly the same thing that we were over a year ago. But, you know, hanging in there, we’re doing our thing,

Vivi: we’re just still here talking about horror.

Erick: You’re still here. We appreciate you for it. . What do you have for group

Vivi: content? Not a ton. I mentioned I think on our last episode that I wanted to watch Piggy, I finally got the chance to

Erick: no subtitles, just fucking

Vivi: Rod dogged it actually.

When [00:01:00] I put it on the second time, it just started playing a dubbed version. Oh. So I just watched it, but I feel like it never really works cuz it takes you out of it. But as far as the plot of the movie I just felt incredibly sad for the main character the entire time. You know, in films you follow around the girl and you keep waiting For her to have her empowering moment in the film, Spoiler alert I feel like that does not happen.

 Till the very end for the main character and there’s just so, but it does happen. Yes, but it’s messed up. It’s really messed up. So I don’t, I don’t know if it was for me

Erick: for that reason alone.

Vivi: Yeah. She has that moment by killing a. serial killer that’s been tormenting her neighborhood, but then she was also kind of falling in love with that serial killer. Mm-hmm. . So it’s a weird take. I don’t know.

Erick: interesting. I know what you mean though. It’s not another horror movie, but Ingrid goes west.

Maybe you feel exactly that same way. Remember I told you that you’re following Abu Plaza’s character. Mm-hmm. and all the way to the end, you’re thinking like, this has to get better for her. Right. And it never really feels like it does, it ends on a light note. But you’re like, I don’t feel any better [00:02:00] about how this ended.

Vivi: Yeah. It was definitely gory though, if you’re looking for that. But I just felt sad for the main character the entire time. And I want to have that moment with the final girl that’s like, yeah, they regained their power. And I don’t feel like I had that with this one.

Erick: you were a final girl.

I’m not exactly sure you did it though. .

Vivi: What do you got for creepy

Erick: content? couple things. we guess sit on a couple shows since the last time we recorded. We guessed it with Joe from Flyover State of Fear covering the Killer Clowns from Outer Space. love that

Vivi: movie so much.

So fun. So camp.

Erick: yeah, go listen to the episode. It’s how already I think today as recording , It is ridiculous. So don’t go in there thinking like it’s another hereditary. cotton candy ray guns.

Vivi: Well, would the title like Killer Clowns from Outer Space?

Erick: It could be. It,

Vivi: it really could actually , I think it just blew my mind.

Erick: It is a killer clown from on face, we guessed with Dinin Deadly.

Our Friends Renae, we talked about the movie Trash Fired. I had never heard of it. Had

Vivi: you? No. And I’m always just glad that they agreed to have us come back on. Cuz I feel like we just say the most [00:03:00] ridiculous stuff on

Erick: their show. . Yeah. definitely was a trash fire of a movie. Definitely check it out.

I hated a lot of the characters. Oh yeah. Half of the movie is like in one setting and then the rest of it feels like the second part of Pearl. If that makes sense. Mm-hmm. .

Vivi: I’m sure by the time we edit this and get it out it

Erick: will be out. If not, go listen to everything else ly has to offer. You were gonna join us, but you were so sleepy that you ended up cutting out short on that one. I did, but we watched House, the 1977 film and

Vivi: I’m bummed because I’ve been wanting to watch this film for a

Erick: while. We should still watch it.

It is honestly insane.

Vivi: I’ve literally only heard people loving this

Erick: movie. I have nothing bad to say about it. Yeah, it’s amazing. it’s really good. Like the actual horror parts are crazy. There’s like a dismembered body playing the piano. Like just imagine what that sounds like. we should watch that after this.

Yeah, we should. Yeah. What do you have for a comfort content?

Vivi: So, I have a couple things. I am late to both of these shows. But I started watching Fleabag. I know it’s like critically acclaimed and it’s won awards and everything. I just started it, but I love it.

I’m sure [00:04:00] you know this by now. It’s hilarious and dark and everything I love about a show, one that is not as dark, has a little bit of dark elements because it’s taking place in a turbulent time. These dairy girls or dairy girls, I don’t know how to pronounce it. Durry? Durry, I don’t know.

Yeah, they have very thick ends.

Erick: Thick acid . They have thick accents.

Vivi: Super hilarious. We’ll cheer you up anytime you watch it. Recommend both

Erick: highly. I’ve wanted to watch dairy, but it’s just so bunny things I wanna watch that I haven’t gotten to. So that’s good. It’s good to hear.

It’s, at least funny. The trailers are hilarious. Yeah. Yeah. Caught my eye. What I have is Amman and the was Quantum Mania came out. Ant Man’s actually much said people’s disagreement. Amman’s probably one of my top three superheroes, comic book-Wise . There’s a lot of shit online about the latest movies of the MCU and shows and stuff. And honestly, I’m like, dude, you’re a 40 year old man complaining about a comic book movie.

Oh yeah, 30, 40 years ago people would’ve dreamed of having these sorts of things. And yeah, I get it. It’s like, have fun accepting [00:05:00] trash. But it’s like, dude, it’s a comic book movie. Yeah. Fuck off. Honestly. So I had fun with it. I’ll take in anything Marvel sends my way, so don’t take my word for it, but check it out.

Midnight Suns is also another Marvel game that I picked up, but it’s supposed to be like, on the darker side of the lore, has some of the more dark characters like Blade ghost Rider name, Nico Mink, from the Runaways.

probably sounds like gibberish, but if you’ve heard of these characters, they’re like the magic and the dark side of the Marvel Universe. Dr. Strange is in there too. Record of re Rock’s another anime that was recommended to me.

Not horror, but if you think body horror counts as being close enough. Record of re rock has some fucked up shit that happens in it. . Yeah. People’s heads have been turned backwards. People’s bodies have been like smashed down into their own bones cuz they couldn’t resist attacks. It’s Sure, sure. Dark. So check that out. And then along the lines of Ragner Rock, I’ve also been playing God of war Ragner Rock finally. I like how

Vivi: your comfort content all had themes. It was like Marvel and Ragner

Erick: Rock . Oh yes. Seriously. I didn’t even do that on purpose. Which could

Vivi: also be a part of Marvel because there’s store rag and rock.

Erick: There [00:06:00] is. I did that on purpose, let’s just say that. Yeah. You

Vivi: planned

Erick: it. Yep. No, but God, war is fun. I like playing video games for story too. I know that recently I’ve been playing like horror games, but once in a lifetime. I had preferred playing games with good stories than even watching anything.

So, makes sense. There’s that. now that we’ve gotten all that stuff out the way, let’s talk about this drink.

Vivi: Maybe I can put like a swear piece. Oh, you should totally do that.

Erick: I hope that drink worked out. I’m sure it did. Just think about how good it tastes

Vivi: or just drink it to get drunk and then you’ll forget how it tastes.

I think if you’re over the age

Erick: of 21,

Vivi: let us know if this drink gets you buzzed. Haha. Ha ha

Erick: ha.

 Let’s hear these fun facts

Vivi: Okay, so I think I’m only gonna share about two fun facts up top and then try to trickle the rest in throughout the movie. Cuz there is a lot for this movie. I think there’s that added layer of this film takes place in Chicago where from Chicago.

So we know like a couple things. Not everything, cuz sometimes I feel Chicago neighborhoods are their own little world, that’s [00:07:00] so big. Yeah, yeah.

DeCosta was actually the first black female director to hit number one in the US Box office movie charts with this film

Erick: ever, ever. In 2021 in

Vivi: the year of our Lord 2021. What the fuck?

Erick: Great for her. I mean, yes. No, she kicked ass. Fucked up

Vivi: for the world we live

Erick: in.

Honestly, I’m surprised about a lot of the most recent like awards that have been Yeah. They are too recent.

Vivi: she’s also set to direct a Marvel film called The Marvels.

Yeah.

Erick: I can’t wait. Yeah. Much to people’s dismay. I know people hate Bree Larson, but I’m excited to see the actress who’s in this actually hope, I hope I pronounce this right, but Te Paris.

she’s gonna play Monica Rambo, which in the comics I think had been switched over to Photon, but from fact she’s the original, got the Marvel

Vivi: and people really hate Brie Larson.

So I can see why the direction was

Erick: taken. Yeah, it’s But anyway, back to the DeCosta ass. She

Vivi: is kicking ass. One thing I really appreciate that she did in this film was She featured all Chicago based artists whenever Art is present in the film.

So you know that art exhibit that we see, the paintings that Anthony creates [00:08:00] depicting all the canyon men and this also includes the composer for this film, which must have been a daunting task because the first film’s music is

Erick: so good. Yeah, it’s like a part of the identity of the movie, but absolutely.

No, that’s really awesome. I already have a big complaint with cinema sometimes because not enough happens in Chicago and then for it to focus on the group that is in focus in this movie in general. So it is like an extra step on that. I’ll tell you what we thought of the, music We ended up getting the, wax work records We don’t have it outta the plastic because we hadn’t seen the movie until now. But I can’t wait to put it on cuz I do like the music.

Yeah, that

Vivi: music. Cured my depression. It is so good. ,

a thing that I found super interesting that the composer did was he actually recorded ambient sounds from the area of Caprini Green.

Oh, great. To be featured in the song. So you feel like you’re a part of

Erick: that. Interesting. Now I feel like I have to go pay attention to mine. Yeah. It could be. The music is really iconic. it is,

Vivi: like you said, it makes itself feel like a character in this

Erick: film.

I feel like this era of horror movies is also like doing a lot of like [00:09:00] vocals where it feels like you have a choir in the room, but it’s not quite a choir. It feels disembodied. There’s something like eerie about people screaming and a high bitch.

Yes.

Vivi: that is what he did. He recorded his vocals like screaming and incorporated it into his

Erick: music. Oh, sick. Okay. Mm-hmm. .

Vivi: Truly, after I watch these movies, the music is just stuck

Erick: in my head.

Vivi: But again, I have more facts that I’ll just say throughout

Erick: the film. Okay, if those film facts didn’t cure your depression, maybe Bebe’s speed run will, it will not. ,

Vivi: I couldn’t tell you that right now.

Erick: we’ll see about that.

Are you ready? I guess so. Say it five times.

candy, man.

Vivi: Oh no. We are not white. We don’t do that here. .

Erick: All right. Ready, set, go.

Vivi: Okay, so we open the backstory of Sherman, who is another depiction of Candyman. Um, And then we flash forward to current times and we meet Brianna and Anthony. They are artists in the Chicago scene. They’re having a dinner party with Brianna’s brother who tells them the story of Candyman, who then sets um, Anthony on this journey of discovering this urban legend and incorporating it into his [00:10:00] artwork.

We meet horrible people in the art scene who are looking to exploit him and his creativity. Um, But the more he explores and learns about Candyman, the more obsessed he gets. And obviously this reignites the legend. People are saying his name five times in the mirror, getting murdered, left and right.

Brianna’s kind of not believing him. She’s just kind of seeing him dissent into madness. Um, Eventually we learned that Anthony is actually the baby from the first film where the original Candyman tried to burn him and Helen. Um, We even discovered that the man who tells him the legend is like terrible and exploiting him and then everybody dies.

The end Uhhuh . I failed pretty bad .

Erick: I knew you were gonna say that too. I was like, she can’t even use it here because that’s not,

Vivi: I can, A lot of people do die,

Erick: but not the end. Not the end. No. If anything, the ending is like, tell everyone Actually it’s gonna continue. Yes it is. It’s not the end. , you

Vivi: lost? I did.

I lost pretty bad. Do we need to

Erick: take a shot? No, absolutely not. Yeah, the listeners are gonna come up for us. They’re gonna

Vivi: kill us. I think they’re gonna be okay.

Erick: A shot. other [00:11:00] than being like still another half hour of the movie Left

That’s right. Thanks. That’s good, . Are you for some Candyman?

Vivi: I am ready. We have held off watching this film until we were gonna cover it, but ever since we saw the original Candyman, I have been wanting to see this. And it did not disappoint at all.

Erick: No. Yeah, the movie ended and. I think you and I were both like quiet, sitting down watching contemplating

One, because the credits stay around for it. Mm-hmm. ,

Vivi: those end credits as well as all the puppets that we see throughout are also created by Chicago artists.

Erick: Yeah. But yeah, I was left like trying to process what changed from the lore of the original, but also how good the change was, in comparison.

I had previously heard people say like, this is a love letter to the original. the other one has a ton of sequels, right. That are out the window now. Yes, I’ve

Vivi: heard They’re not that great. This is very on trend with the whole, we are just redoing the sequel ,

Erick: the

Vivi: recall thel, if you will.

And I thoroughly enjoyed it. So let’s get into it.

Erick: Okay. a boy named Billy plays with shadows and reenacts a cop chasing a man using these paper cutouts that we’ll see used throughout the [00:12:00] film. It’s 1977 in Cabrini Green, which we saw in the first movie. His mom yells at him to go to laundry and we hear some kids yell at Billy that they hope Sherman gets him.

Some cops sit in the car outside the building. We recognize from the original Candyman asking people if they’ve seen a man on a wanted side, but Willie just ignore. Sorry, Willie. but Billy just ignores

Vivi: them. Yeah. I always find it odd that Billy is a nickname

Erick: for Will instead of just Willie.

Yeah, but it’s Willie. Weird because it’s penis. I don’t

Vivi: know. You can name a child Richard, and they call him Dick. That’s unfortunate. That

Erick: is also very true. let’s uh, normalize Willie over Billy. Billy is always a. Serial killer. Yeah. Billy enters and actually,

Vivi: fuck. Oh shit. We just figure it out. Another one,

Erick: Billy enters an eerie laundry room with a flickering light and a big hole in the brick leading to darkness.

the light switch is one of those timers. That one sits up. The light turns off. I don’t know how much people get exposure to those kinds of lights, but I used to see ‘ em a lot when I was growing up, especially at school. Hate those. Yeah. They’re the worst Billy. Mines his business though. When suddenly a candy’s thrown into the room from the hole in the wall, the light from the laundry room [00:13:00] shuts off as a man with a hooked hand enters through the hole with his hand out. Watching the film, I was like, this isn’t candyman. It’s hooked.

That’s odd, right? You’re mm-hmm. . You go into this not knowing anything, so you’re like, is it actually him? Outside the cops here. Billy’s screaming in Rush into the building intro credit’s roll while we see an upside down Foggy Chicago.

The upside down, foggy Chicago is also reminiscent to how the first movie Yes, it is. does the same thing just as the upside down. Just

Vivi: inversed

Erick: like a mirror.

Yeah. Another thing that I thought about this man with the hook was that he was maybe that guy that was going under the moniker of Candyman

Vivi: in the original. Yes, I thought so too when I first saw it, but we learned that that is not the case.

Mm-hmm. ,

Erick: Anthony and Brianna are being visited by her brother, Troy and his boyfriend. When we get a little banter about how it was a bad idea to get an apartment where they did, Anthony is an artist and Brianna sells the art, so they’d moved close to their gallery, but Troy says the area is haunted. He mentions all the names it’s ever had, including Smokey Hollow Combat Alley, and now Cabrini Green.

They give some exposition that it used to be the projects and had a bad reputation until it was gentrified, making people think it was going to [00:14:00] get better, but they really just made everything around it better.

Vivi: This is an interesting approach. I feel like they had to take, because the area of Caprini Green was gentrified and a lot of the high towers, high rises that we saw in the original film were taken down almost, I think.

almost immediately after. It was like the late nineties, early two thousands when they started taking down those buildings.

Erick: And what’s there now?

Vivi: like condos for people in the city, but the rows of houses that we do see throughout the film are still

Erick: there.

Vivi: I believe they’re mostly abandoned as

Erick: well.

Troy turns off all the lights and tells the story we all know of Candyman and Helen while shown the story in that shadowy paper cut style. The story ends where the people of Cabrini Green managed to take the baby from Helen, and she just walks into the fire.

Troy and his boyfriend leave, as he mentions he’s tired of his sister supporting Anthony’s life. Brianna shrugs it off, but Anthony is in his feels about it. While getting ready for bed that night, Brianna tries to hype Anthony up for their visit by Clive art dealer.

The next day by Anthony’s deepen his phone, looking for more about this Candyman story. Brianna takes his phone saying she doesn’t want to get haunted in her new apartment. Anthony jokes, it’s not haunted because it was on Zillow, which [00:15:00] I disagree with. absolutely doesn’t mean

Vivi: shit.

Erick: If

Vivi: anything, I’m sure Zillow would promote that it’s haunted . Also, this art dealer is named Clive after Clive Barker, who was the original author of the candy band story.

Erick: Oh, I wouldn’t even have gotten that

Vivi: kind of sad because this character is a douche .

 if anything to me, I think they should’ve named the character of William Clive because he creates candyman again.

Erick: But this character sucks.

 Clive isn’t really impressed by Anthony’s work and wants to see quote, the great black hope of the Chicago art scene of tomorrow.

Anthony mentions he wants to work on something about the projects and how white people create these spaces of neglect for communities of. the way Clive responds to Anthony is so off-putting. Like he knows better about this topic than Anthony getting excited every time Anthony mentions even a little bit about the black experience, Clive is dismissive and prioritizes what the art world is gonna think.

Rather than understanding Anthony’s interests in exploring social issues and making meaningful art.

Vivi: It is incredibly upsetting to hear this conversation between the two. it just pisses you off. .

Erick: Yeah. The literal sentence. Oh, Southside’s [00:16:00] played out. Dude, fuck you.

Vivi: It’s played out. What the fuck are you talking about?

Those are people’s lives and I think it, I do not know anything about the art scene, but I definitely think it speaks to communities exploiting other communities for profit.

Erick: Mm-hmm. , not the same thing. . But I told you about the time that I went to go to this like, environmental Oh yeah. Community thing And they kept talking about how like, everything in Chicago is great, we’re all recycling, everyone’s following the rules and we’ve done so much for the community.

I was there with my niece and I was like, actually, I don’t think you have, cuz on the south side, the only reason that people recycle is because you’ve threatened them that they’re gonna get fined if they don’t. Mm-hmm. , it’s not like a positive thing down there. You guys are up here in your little pocket in a library acting like everything’s great and we can report on it and it’s amazing.

But you don’t really give a shit about the people in these other areas there’s no one here representing this space. And when I brought it up, it felt like people in the room were uncomfortable Good. like we don’t want to hear about the truth. Okay. We just want to glow about

Vivi: You wanna pretend we’re doing amazing? Yeah. Yeah,

Erick: that night.

Anthony does tons of research on Cabrini Green and goes out to take some pictures. [00:17:00] The next day he gets stung on the hand by a bee while taking a photo, but continues his research entering the projects. It’s important to point out that when the bee falls to the ground, answer, immediately swarming it The swarming is obviously a theme that we’re gonna continue to see throughout the rest of this film, where the first one sort of felt like the bees were a theme just related to Candyman as a character. In this one, there’s a double meaning to what swarming means

Vivi: The scene I wanna point out, because he’s taking a picture of an old church and he has the old reference photo of the church in his hand. And you can tell it looks completely different, right? So in the original photo he has is actually back when Caprini Green was mostly inhabited by people of color and that church served that community.

So that church was actually hand painted by a black artist of that community. Then when it started to get gentrified, it was painted over to cover it. So he has the original artwork in his hand, and then when you look up, you see the church completely painted and it’s so infuriating when something that feels like it should be preserved [00:18:00] historically is painted over.

Erick: That’s so fucking upsetting. It reminds

Vivi: me of when um, a couple years ago. Do you remember the Pilsen Stop? It’s known Yeah. For having crazy murals and the city of Chicago wanted to paint over it and people were furious. .

Erick: it’s upsetting that they would paint over it. It’s cool that that little details in there too. Yeah. I didn’t notice the art on the church in the photo.

Vivi: Well I thought it was very standout that he’s like referencing old photos of this community.

It’s like nothing’s done on accident. Right. That has to mean something.

Erick: looking at old photos of Chicago are interesting too. I saw some photos recently of like commercial and how Oh yeah. That place used to be popping popular. It used to be. Yeah. And you see like the Rainbow store that’s there.

Mm-hmm. full of people and, and then you look back at it now sometimes and you’re like, wow, this place is sad. Yes. After getting startled by some police driving by, Anthony meets William, who grew up there. They go to a laundromat where William tells him more about Cabrina Green.

He makes a comment about how so many other people have died in the area. He even names a couple and says, but no, no one cares. One white girl dies though and the story [00:19:00] lives on forever

Vivi: Helen was a white savior.

Erick: She really was. I wonder if that continues on to the other sequels for the original. I

Vivi: don’t know.

I dunno if I wanna watch ’em cause I’ve only heard negative things and I really loved these two movies. ,

Erick: it’s interesting cuz they have negative reviews, but Tony Todd for all of them, right? Yes. Anth. I think I would just watch it for an Tony. Yeah. William tells Anthony his version of the Candyman story for him, emphasis on For him, Candyman was Sherman Fields.

He had a hook for a hand and handed out candy to little kids. The police started looking for him when a little white girl found a razor blade in her candy, so he disappeared. turns out William is the little kid we saw at the start. Sherman’s sticks his hand out with candy, but since William was spooked, he screamed that’s when the cops came running in.

William says he saw the true face of fear. As we see Sherman looking out in fear to the shadows of cops running past, he still takes the candy, but as he goes up the stairs, cops come swarming in and kills Sherman reveals that razor blades still showed up in people’s candy afterwards, proven that Sherman was innocent the whole time.

This is an

Vivi: incredibly sad story, but I feel like I [00:20:00] understand why they decided to go this direction with the lore of Candyman and not stick to the original. because people were only gonna keep comparing it to Tony Todd’s performance.

Erick: And this way you can say Candyman is anyone.

Vivi: You could make your own identity for this film and present a new story, but it’s still loyal enough that I, I don’t feel like this is just completely not candyman,

Erick: you know?

Yeah. I don’t feel it either. it’s doing the same thing that the first one kind of does too. In scapegoating, remember the guy who was using the Candyman moniker to put fear into the people of the community. What would make you think that this is any different?

You know, it’s like we’re using the same thing, just kind of spinning

Vivi: it. It’s expanding on lore that was already planted

Erick: in the first film. Yeah. but it is really sad. Yeah. The, razor blades just popping up. I knew that was gonna happen immediately. Yeah.

Vivi: And again, that whole razor blade in candies is just like a universal urban legend. No matter where you’re from. You’ve heard this urban legend.

Erick: Yeah. Anthony goes back to their apartment inspired and starts painting. Brianna gets home and starts talking to Anthony about how he hasn’t visited or talked to his mom for a [00:21:00] while. He’s too excited to keep talking about his mom, though, and rushes Brianna to see what he’s been working on.

He tells her the story of Sherman while we see the piece shows a bunch of blooded hands covering an unrecognizable face over time. People forgot Sherman’s name and just the name Candyman Brianna’s disturbed by it and says it doesn’t leave room for interpretation. It’s a very literal take on something that happened.

Anthony says he hasn’t had this much clarity before and explains one last thing. The five times rule. They have a large mirror in the living room, which is kind of cool, but also creepy. it also has this like dark tint on it, right? That’s the window. Oh, I thought it was a mirror. It’s the window.

It’s the reflection mirror. I was like, wow, that’s a big ass dark mirror. . It’s black Mirror . Yeah. Okay. even this is day I was like, wow. They have like a large, full sized. Dark tinted

Vivi: that would scare the fuck out of me. If you had like a large mirror in the living room at night, I’d just be like,

Erick: ah, oh, it’s me I didn’t realize it was the window outside. Anyway, there’s a large window in the background of the living room and Anthony says they should summon him. Brianna doesn’t want to, but he does it anyway and they break out into a play fight before we cut [00:22:00] away.

We see Candyman though, standing in the reflection behind them. Keep an eye on too, if you’re watching this. Mm-hmm. all the reflections because I pointed out a couple to you that you hadn’t even noticed. We paused and we reminded a couple times cause I was like, look, it’s his shoulder. Look. It’s his arm.

Vivi: Yeah. It’s something that I really appreciate and I think it’s really well done how they play with the whole mirror element. , expanding on it more than the first

Erick: film. sometimes your eyes are playing with you. You’re like, wait, is that him again? Oh no. That’s just Anthony’s reflection.

And then it cuts away and comes back and it is his mm-hmm. reflection. Mm-hmm. . It’s a interesting way to use mirrors in this

Vivi: another fun fact that I found this one on imdb, so I don’t know how credible it is, but it claims that Anthony McCoy’s name is set a total of five times throughout the film. The full name, this full name, which I thought was interesting. I was watching it before recording and I was trying to count every time they say his full name, did you find five?

I got distracted in the last like 10 minutes because it gets so intense in the last 10 minutes. Mm-hmm.

Erick: William does say Anthony McCoy, the last bit he does. . Yeah, I love it when movies put in lily strings like that at the art show.

And the next day, one girl in particular looks over Anthony’s [00:23:00] piece consisting of a bathroom mirror on a wall. The piece is called Say My Name. It invites the viewer to say Candy man’s name five times. We’ll explain in the story of Helen and Sherman and the skeletons in the community’s closet,

Vivi: so this say my name that keeps reoccurring in the movie. I believe I saw an interview that the director said that she was inspired by the slogan that was used a lot throughout the Black Lives Matter movement to put emphasis on, people of the community who had unfortunately lost their lives to police brutality.

Erick: yeah, I think I saw some of the things and I figured. , it was related to the Black Lives Matter movement.

Especially with, you know, make sure that you remember the names of those who’ve been affected at least in the public eye. And those who are unknown. Yes. Those who don’t have names that we don’t even know about are happening So before. She walks away from the painting. She’s taking pictures of it when she’s called away, but we’re probably gonna see her again. Anthony enthusiastically approaches this piece as a critic. Looks over it. While Clive tells Brianna to tell him to stop hogging the critic. Dude, Clive is a piece of shit like, dude,

Vivi: oh, so you’re, fuck you art dealer.

Don’t you make more money if your clients like schmooze with [00:24:00] the

Erick: critics? How are you gonna like speak him up to in the private and be like, I want you to be the next black hope of Chicago’s art community. And then be like, oh man, here comes this guy again with his fucking art. His ass fucking art.

Vivi: Yeah.

No, he

Erick: doesn’t make sense to me. No. And also she just got there cuz he says that immediately as she’s approaching the thing and he’s like, he’s, he’s hogging all the critics. ,

Vivi: all of them, all one of them.

Erick: They all clearly don’t care for the direction he’s going, including the critic who basically says his piece is hypocritical, claiming that artists often contribute to gentrifying neighborhoods.

She does this by almost going south and saying, you people before clarifying, she’s talking about artists. She also sucks . She does. She’s worse. Anthony drinks for the rest of the night before walking over to join Brianna and the others. A man says he loves what Anthony did with the paintings by hiding them in a storage room with the lights out and asking if he found them in a thrift store in the

Vivi: desert.

I am not part of an art community, but is it just full of assholes that are just

Erick: mean to each other? I don’t know. I was trying to like understand what this character was Cause he comes outta [00:25:00] nowhere. He does. And. . Why would that be his take?

Vivi: I wouldn’t be surprised if he was like an ex-boyfriend of Brianna’s or something.

The way he’s talking

Erick: to Anthony. Yeah. We see him a couple times later too. And he is very like, wow, you’re so great Brianna.

Vivi: Mm-hmm. maybe. Maybe that was a cut scene we

Erick: didn’t get. The others laugh, but Anthony doesn’t hold back.

Tells the dude off before being rushed off by Brianna. I don’t appreciate when Sure. Anthony’s been drinking. He probably should be walked off, but Brianna’s like, you’re embarrassing me. What the fuck? It’s my night. I get it. He just straight fucking told me off. He like talked shit about my heart.

Vivi: But this is her career and she’s supporting both of them at the moment. And he’s drunk, insulting people. You

Erick: Clearly we have an, we’re at an impasse shows over, right. Ride or die.

Vivi: you’ve saved I think it’s also for him because he could be making enemies and this is still his career at

Erick: the end of the day too. I mean, he’s not throwing hands, he’s throwing words yet. ,

Vivi: because let’s say we were at a work function and suddenly you got drunk and started telling off one of your coworkers.

I would be like, you will regret this in the morning. Let’s go[00:26:00] .

Erick: That’s fine. But are you also gonna be like, but fuck that guy. Yes, probably. Okay, good. That’s what I was saying. , I can be taken home. Just agree that he sucks. Okay. as Brianna’s taking Anthony off. Clive says he wouldn’t be there if it wasn’t for Brianna, but Anthony puts him on blast for having sex with his interns.

Vivi: Yeah, this interaction’s really funny cuz he’s like, that wasn’t spontaneous. You were holding onto that one. And he’s like, hell yeah. .

Erick: And the girl’s like, it’s fine. I’m, I’m on uh, I forgot what

Vivi: she says.

Erick: oh,

Vivi: I have my I

Erick: u D in?

Yes. Okay. . And he’s just like, you’re not helping .

Vivi: He’s like, not now.

Erick: Cliven is interned. Jerich. What a name. What a name. That should be the name of our kid. Nove v. Varicose. Vain. Varios Vain. It runs in the family. Oh, that’s unfortunate. Cliven is intern Jerich cleaning up while he complains until she decides to see Candyman.

Five times in front of Anthony’s peace.

He tells her not to do it because he wants to have sex first, but then jokes about her doing it because he’s in a necrophilia. This guy sucks Nero. .

Vivi: That’s

Erick: not the song. No, no, no, no. . She clips her belt to him [00:27:00] and they start making out, as she says it, five times while Anthony stares at himself in the mirror at the apartment. We see Candyman through the mirror as she gets her next sliced open. Clive tries to make a run for it while watching Candyman in a reflection nearby, but it’s too late.

He gets a hook through a leg and dragged back to Jericho, where we see him raised up by Candyman in the reflection. He’s being raised up by no one. It’s really cool scene. It’s the first time we see a slaughter

Vivi: Yes. I really appreciated this kill. It has a beautiful blood splatter, . Mm-hmm. I noticed.

And then the entire scene after it is just done. in a very fun, unique way where you are seeing the reflection of Candyman and then everything he’s touching and interacting with in the real world. You can’t see him. And I really enjoyed this.

Erick: Yeah. The screen that gets ripped apart. Yeah. And Clive is doing what we’re doing looking back and forth like we would mm-hmm.

It’s really cool. I would hate to have a hook through the foot though, and get dragged by. I would hate to have a

Vivi: hook through anything,

Erick: every which way. Mm-hmm. the next day, Anthony paints intensely and notices his hand is getting really nasty from the bee sting.

Vivi: He [00:28:00] waits way too long to go to a doctor for this.

Erick: Yes. .

Vivi: There are times where I’m not sure if the B bike getting worse is just him, or if other people can see it.

Because a lot of people act like they can’t see what’s happening, but then they do later on mention it or say stuff about it. But I would be way more

Erick: concerned, especially with like, like going up to his neck I think if you saw me with it going up my arm, you’d be like, I think we need to go to the hospital.

Yeah. Forget the art . I think the other part that’s interesting cuz you said like it could be him I thought it was the Candyman. persona taking Anthony over the movie does well to like trick you. focusing in on Anthony Beck in the art room and then having Clive and Jerica killed out at the gallery.

Vivi: Yeah. I think it is meant to be like the sting is now infecting him with the Candyman persona, lore, whatever you wanna

Erick: call it. He’s manifesting these things happening. Yeah,

Vivi: I’m just saying, especially in the scene later on where he sees his mother. I am pretty sure any mother would be like, what is going on?

Go to the hospital right now, ,

Erick: forget the candy [00:29:00] man. Have you seen your fucking face looking like Freddie Krueger, my dude. Meanwhile, Brianna is the lucky one who gets to find the bodies of Clive and Jerich at the gallery.

We cut to the news where they mentioned Jerich and Clive’s bodies were found in front of Anthony’s piece, he’s just stoked to hear that they said his name and the name of his piece. Troy Andre are like, this is funny.

Vivi: They pan out and Troy and Brianna are looking at him like, what the fuck is wrong with you

Erick: to Anthony’s defense, he’s like, he didn’t kill anybody. It’s just cool. It’s kinda cool, but also, I mean, it’s fucked,

Vivi: but especially if you’re an artist and you know, getting your name out there is everything.

Erick: Now I’m on the news. Let’s just hope it doesn’t come back and bite me in the ass. later that night, Brianna has a nightmare where interchangeably we see her finding the bodies, but also a time when she was a kid and saw her dad drop himself out a window.

Vivi: What a horrible. traumatizing thing. And I think it’s made only more heartbreaking with him realizing that his child is in the room and saying, I bet you didn’t know your father could fly.

And then jumping to his

Erick: death, it’s also a red herring, right? Because he’s wearing a jacket that looks like the Candyman jacket. It’s a yellow [00:30:00] hue.

Vivi: I don’t think it’s a red herring. He’s also

Erick: a painter. I thought they were trying to say that even Brianna has a relationship to a Candyman experience in her past.

Yeah. Mm-hmm. . And so it would make sense that Brianna, again, going back to like her pushing Anthony off and not defending things like that, she does have skeletons in her own closet, Troy later says, you don’t have to be there every time tortured artist decides to have a psychotic break.

It’s really sad and, makes sense that Brianna would try to like, avoid it and just be like, Fuck it. you need to stop being crazy. We have a job to do. . Yeah. She wakes up from the nightmare and finds Anthony running his hand through water. He says he also had a nightmare. So she asks him about it. But he just shoves her out the bathroom. Anthony goes to the library and has

Vivi: someone pull? Did you notice? Huh? When he shuts the door and he looks in the mirror, his reflection does not look up.

Erick: Oh no, I didn’t see that.

Vivi: Yeah. I’m

Erick: pretty sure that’s what happens. Anthony goes to a library and has someone pull some of Helen’s records. Why is this girl like hitting on him I know.

Vivi: She’s like so into

Erick: him. There’s nothing that led to this either. He’s just like, can I get the Candyman files? And she’s just like, well, so like, what [00:31:00] classes are you in? He’s gone. Yeah, .

Vivi: maybe it’s a character that’s meant to look like Helen or

Erick: she’s related. Could be. He listens to a tape she recorded describing Candyman As the community’s survival tool evolved from the need to protect itself and its children from the horrors of the community.

He’s listening as he gets into an elevator that starts to glitch out, she’s saying how haunting it is to see horrors in one’s own reflection. As this elevator is literally surrounded by mirrors. You as the viewer are sitting wondering when something’s about the jump at you. When a candy falls from the ceiling, Anthony opens it up, but gets cut by a razor blade.

Suddenly we hear wheezing and when he looks up, we see a bloodied candyman smiling back at him. The elevator glitches. One more time before the doors open and a bunch of students see Anthony being weird.

Vivi: This scene is fantastic. First of all, that is the cleanest fucking elevator I’ve ever seen , especially in like a school with all those mirrors.

Yeah, yeah. And I just love how it’s infinite it is genuinely scary when you see Sherman’s face. .

Erick: Have you ever stood in a elevator like that? Yes. I hate it. And it does feel like you’re in another [00:32:00] dimension or something. When you move your head once, one of them’s not gonna move with it. Yep. you and your head are like, no, it’s not gonna happen.

Like, I’m gonna look away. And obviously nothing’s going on, but you’re still left with that. But I can’t see. And what if it is different? ? Like that, video from when we were younger where the little kid like turns around, and they turn around and grab a toy and the reflection stays looking.

Yeah.

Vivi: There’s so many videos like that online. .

Erick: Oh, it’s insane. I do like that Sherman is just staring back. had theories about this too, like why is Sherman the only one that’s been appearing for Anthony at all? And I thought it was probably because he’s the last one. The most recent one could be.

Yeah. Yes. But then later we see he could honestly be any of them.

Vivi: it could be that Sherman was the one that affected. William’s character the most. And we learned later on William’s role in all

Erick: this So he is like shoving Sherman’s Candyman onto Anthony. Yeah.

Conjuring him up a little bit. Anthony paints intensely while listening to more tapes until he gets a call.

Vivi: is this Helen’s voice on these recordings?

Erick: The actress? Yes. It’s supposed to be Helen, the character, but I’m not sure that it’s,

Vivi: I believe it is her voice.

Her, is she still alive?[00:33:00] I think so. She was in a horrible movie that we recently watched. Oh, the Haunting. She played the main character’s Sister

Erick: Oh. At the beginning for like two seconds.

Yeah, that’s right. Yeah. . I Anthony paints intensely while listening to more tapes until he gets a call. he tells Brianna he’s gotta go, but she says they have a dinner that night with Jack Hyde who never comes to Chicago. She asks him not to fuck this up for her, and he assures her he won’t.

But seriously for me, don’t fuck this up for me. I get it. we know too that he is gonna fuck it up When you say that with emphasis, you’re like, all right, well, he’s gonna fuck it up . He goes to the critics apartment who’s suddenly interested in his work, given how macab it was and the murders that happened around them.

Vivi: She’s a true crime girlie. She just wants the fame around the crime. All she needed was the wine.

Erick: Anthony feels she’s implying he had something to do with it and finally gets back to her about her comment on how artists gentrify the hood. He tells her how a city cuts off a community and waits for it to die. Then invites artists, young people, white people preferably, or only to stick it out long enough to open a Whole Foods .

Vivi: I’m just glad that he was able to get back at her for her

Erick: comments. Yeah, she definitely was fucking out of pocket with [00:34:00] all her

Vivi: shit. She’s a character that seems very similar to me, like Clive, where they are trying to profit. Off of this community’s

Erick: pain. it’s all over the news. His name’s on the news.

Yeah, we need to get the story before it’s too late. He asks her that if she really wants to get it, she should say his name five times. She gets nervous and goes to the washroom where It’s funny cuz she’s just like, I got a shit. Whoa. Got a little fucking hot in there. Huh? . She gets nervous and goes to the washroom where we can only assume she actually does it.

While Anthony waits, we hear the Candyman whispering his name. He picks at his hand though and almost peels a piece off before deciding to stop.

Vivi: It’s still like way too much that he peels at it and it, he’s looking for a napkin. But I legit thought he was gonna grab like one of the bottles that she has there and pour it over, you know like a wound.

Oh. Like to disinfect

Erick: it? I thought you were gonna say he’s gonna break it and just

Vivi: carve out. Oh the, I feel like that’s another movie where they carve out Infect it. Oh. The movie you showed me

Erick: ruins. Oh, yes. Yeah. Nasty. Fun fact, when I was a kid, I had warts on the bottom of my foot. to get rid of warts, you have [00:35:00] to freeze them and then cut them off.

You do? Yeah. It’s fucking gross. I got them from being barefooted in TaeKwonDo. Oh, gross. Yeah. But anyway, I thought he was gonna carve out his wound personally like body horror is a thing, right?

Mm-hmm. . But I personally, when I have a wound, I’m intrigued by like, wow, it’s already healed up. I wonder how far I can peel it off already. I am

Vivi: a picker, I pick at my face and yeah, I pick at scabs too. when it gets to that point where it’s gushing blood is when you stop

Erick: preaches, zone He realizes the critic’s taking a while and goes to knock in a mirror. Nearby, though he sees Candy Man’s reflection is his own. he does the mirror thing where you move around to see if the reflection does the same until the critic startles him to ask if he’s okay.

Vivi: The scene is great. It foreshadows him becoming the Candyman with, you know, moving his hand and in the place of his scarred hand is the hook. My only beef with it is, is c g I used in this scene. It feels like it’s used a little

Erick: bit. It feels like a scene that wouldn’t need it because it’d be easy to just put a glass and a hallway.

Vivi: Yeah, it’d be easier done practically. It does look like cgi like a little bit. Right, and, and that was my one [00:36:00] thing. I was like, I don’t know if that needed that,

Erick: maybe they just were like, well, if we’re gonna have to CGI the bugs in. Oh, could be. Could be. Yeah. Maybe we just like edit it a little bit Movies this day and age. Even if they’re not CGing a thing into a scene, they will like heavily modify if something looks off, you know? So maybe they were like, well, if he’s not moving exactly the way Anthony is. Mm-hmm. , maybe they speed or adjust some things on Sherman’s character.

Vivi: Could be.

I definitely am not a fan of this. I think practical effects are what make a movie age better, because I have an issue with something later in this movie for the same reason. Yes, I

Erick: know. We’ll get to it. . I was like, he’s not that old. He looks great. No, I

Vivi: think you could have done it with lighting and makeup.

Okay. Anyway, anyway. Yeah, . We’ll

Erick: save it for the end, but the voice is right. Oh, it’s him. It’s Stunning. Stunning. After he gets startled by the critic, he runs off. But we can see the candy man in the bathroom behind her. It’s so cool. It, it was you know, blinking.

You missed it thing. Mm-hmm. , I think this was one of the ones you missed. And I was, look, he’s standing in like the distance in the farthest corner of the bathroom. Reflection. As he leaves the apartment though, we zoom away from the building and see her murdered and [00:37:00] dragged across her window. . This

Vivi: is odd to say about a murder scene, but this is beautifully shot

Erick: and framed

Cuz she just walks. It doesn’t look too cheesy. No, it gets raised up. You’re zoomed out enough Slammed against the window. Yeah. Dragged stream of blood. She just drops. She just drops

Vivi: And that drag across the window is meant to replicate.

When Anthony first gets intrigued by the candyman lore, you know how he paints that super long streak. Oh. And it transitions into the next scene.

Erick: Hmm. damnit some of these details. I’m like, want to go see you though, . I gotta go rewatch it. Yeah. Yeah. Anthony makes it to the dinner and picks at his hand.

That’s nasty and bloody at this point when a girl at the table’s like, Hey, you fucking good or you want to leave? She’s like,

Vivi: can you not? And I would be like, oh my God, we need to get this man to a hospital. Why are you here?

Erick: Yes. I’m sure he was late too. He just shows up as quiet and just picking at his bloody Clive.

Yeah. Everyone is stuck. Brianna up with all these opportunities and accolades. One guy even says Clive had to die for her to finally be free. When they all get a text at Finley, the critic is dead. Brianna clearly knows [00:38:00] what’s up because she looks directly at Anthony. Suspicious. I have like thoughts about this because I think that the Williams story I told you didn’t need to happen like it could have, but I think at the end where he like ends up framing Anthony.

I’m like, well, William didn’t have to do it. It seems like the movie was already going in that direction, whether William had a push or not. everything that has been happening to Anthony, it’s looking like Anthony did something, whether Anthony did it or not, in the public eye. Yeah. He was there when Finley’s dead.

People were murdered in front of his artwork. He’s got this weird bloody hand, you know, people are gonna notice.

Anthony runs off making himself look even more suspicious. He goes back to William to ask who Candyman is, but William clarifies. Candyman is a bunch of people. Samuel Evans was a man run down during the white housing riots of the fifties. William Bell was lynched in the twenties. He eventually lands on the first one from the 1890s and tells the story of Daniel Robi.

says they were all real, and Candyman is the way they deal with the fact that these things happened and still do. All the stories are fucked up. Like I said, yes, stay till the end of the credits because [00:39:00] you do get a glimpse of each of those stories in the paper cutout style. And it’s a really like sobering set of scenes cuz the music’s also very like beautiful, beautiful.

I mean, you just feel uncomfortable. everything just sucks. Still sucks and still sucks. Yeah.

Vivi: In one of these scenes where Anthony walks in on William Williams reading a book by Clive Barker

Erick: Brianna walks in on Anthony’s art and gets spooked when Anthony barges in telling her not to look at it. He thinks he’s the reason Candyman is back, but Brianna can’t believe any of it. She thinks he’s losing it and tries to prove that Candyman isn’t real by saying his name in the mirror, Anthony freaks out and throws a rock at the mirror further scaring Brianna.

And causing her to leave.

Vivi: I understand what Anthony was trying to do, and I ultimately do think it was smart to destroy the mirrors. However, I can see how this is incredibly terrifying for

Erick: Brianna. Yeah. You think your partner is? at a breaking point and now they’re throwing things another violence.

Dunno, they’re gonna hurt you. yeah. So I don’t blame Brianna at all.

Vivi: I did find it a little bit comical in the scene before this, however, that he just cannot physically cover any of the paintings. , he’s trying to throw tarps at them and just [00:40:00] they all Miss

Erick: Branda goes to Troy’s where he goes off that she doesn’t deserve any of it.

Troy takes this opportunity to tell her that their mom wants to sell their dad’s old artwork, but she doesn’t want anything to do with that. He suggests she do a show to put it on display, but she refuses. So he follows up by saying she doesn’t have to be there every time A tortured artist has a psychotic break.

He apologizes though, for being outta line and tells her she can stay as long as she wants under the condition. She doesn’t try and summon candyman. She’s like, who would be stupid enough to do that? Cut to a bunch of teenagers in high school, one that we saw earlier from the gallery. . I

Vivi: feel like this is the movie’s way of being like, who would do that?

Cut to this is some white people nonsense. because the one girl who runs out is not white. .

Erick: and she said, fuck this . Yeah. Although I will say that when I was a kid, I think I mentioned this in the first Candyman movie, My cousins would fuck with us all the time and be like, go to the bathroom. See Candyman.

Vivi: I would not, I was the person who did not do Bloody Mary. I would not do this. No. I’m Mexican .

Erick: I was gonna say, there’s a lot of other things to be worried about, like DWS and shit too.

Thosey, those you don’t [00:41:00] even know. You’re summoning That’s a family from Wizard’s Place. I hated that storyline.

Vivi: I did not know that that was a storyline. The Kukui family. I didn’t watch

Erick: Wizards Away really quick. I watched like a lot of it.

Vivi: did they do it

Erick: badly? It’s just a very cheesy, cheesy thing. Mm-hmm. , they’re just like a family of people and then they are scary cuz their eyes like, go black or smack. I can’t remember.

Vivi: Oh, like black-eyed children? Yeah.

What’s Disney? You can’t get too scary.

I mean,

Erick: then don’t

Vivi: fucking do it. Oh, speaking of Disney, did you see that? Uh, The new haunted mansion? Yeah. shit. I like the old haunted mansion. I know. I

Erick: thought you didn’t,

Vivi: I didn’t like it felt like when I watched it as a kid, it wasn’t really following the lore, but it actually is now that I’ve watched it when I was older.

Now that you’ve gone to the Hana mansion a million times Yeah. Like

Erick: it, it was based on the

Vivi: ride. On the ride. Yeah. I think it’s really hard. You know that movie? Well, what a tangent. But that movie came about as a result of Pirates of the Caribbean because it was so successful. They’re like, we should turn all our rides into a movie.

And I don’t think it was successful In the way they wanted.

Erick: I don’t think you should do that for all your rides. [00:42:00] No. that’s also like the way that you beat a dead horse, like

Vivi: making a bunch of remakes and recalls.

Erick: Yeah. But the more that we watch movies, the more I realize that this has always been Hollywood. Hollywood has always made remakes. Yes. And people want to act like shit’s new. Yeah. Grew up, cut to the teenager we saw at the gallery, getting her friends together to summon him in the school bathroom as they say it. Weird things start to happen, but they finished and laugh it off.

Oh. A black girl named Trina barges into the bathroom and goes into one of the stalls as the other girls start making fun of her for being hungover. What’s she, is she hungover? I don’t know. They just said like, oh, she’s drinking too much.

They keep roasting her for having drunk too much the day before. Oh. I dunno

Vivi: what’s going on with this story. .

Erick: And I was like, fuck you guys. She puts her headphones on to ignore them while the main teenager realizes the door to the bathrooms is locked. They blame Trina for breaking the door. But one of the other girls looks at herself in a little mirror and notices Candyman behind her.

One of them runs back to the sink because she forgot her vape. And under the stalls, the other girls watch as blood waterfalls down from the sink. This is a very disturbing, like crackling. It almost sounds like an egg. Mm-hmm. like a, and it [00:43:00] pools.

Underneath the vape falls first though. . So if she got her vape, just not worth it in her life. , the main teenager, says they’re being stupid and also goes back to the sinks to get killed, bro. What do you mean ? Did you not hear that sound? Did you not see the blood? Trina thinks they’re pranking her and yells out for them to stop at the little mirror.

Falls in the floor covered in blood, and we watched them get finished off by Candyman. It’s a really cool scene.

Vivi: It is. We see it all from Trina’s perspective. She’s like just trying to pretend she doesn’t exist in the stall while watching this horrific thing happen in a tiny mirror.

Erick: Yeah. I do appreciate the offscreen killing the movie hasn’t stayed away from giving us onscreen kills.

But you’re left to imagine like, what the fuck did he do to them, Anthony wakes up in the apartment and pain noticing his hand has gotten way worse. He pushes at his nails in this body horror moment, making a face of agonizing pain that we can only imagine as a viewer. I’ll for a second cuz we just covered the fly.

Thought back. Yes. Cuz he goes like this,

Vivi: squeezing his finger. . Yeah. I thought the exact

Erick: same thing. . Meanwhile, Brianna is meeting with the important woman from the dinner earlier, but we realize that just like with Anthony and the [00:44:00] critic, Brianna’s significance is being limited to her association with Anthony the tragedy she’s witnessed.

devastating driving in the theme that society and the media likes to exploit the experiences of the black community, especially those of violence while ignoring their talents, achievements, and contributions.

Vivi: I wonder because the woman she is speaking to is supposed to be the director of the M C A.

I wonder if this was filmed in the M C A. It looks like

Erick: it. Yeah. I haven’t been there in a few years, but we should go back. Yeah. I love that. We’ve been talking about it for a while. Place. Anthony is at the hospital when he hears the news report on the girls who were murdered at the high school.

Apparently the police just started to link them to the art world, murders and Anthony’s piece because of the words, say my name, written on the wall in the victim’s blood learning. He was born in the Cabrini Green Hospital.

He goes to visit his mom to find out the truth about his past.

Vivi: I don’t think a nurse has ever said that. You know, welcome back. You were born here ,

Erick: but instead of just like you need, you need a hospital, you need help, bud.

he tells her. He knows about kind man. Kon Kon. He tells her he knows about Candyman and asks her why she lied to him.

Vivi: Hold up, hold up. This is the [00:45:00] original actress from 1992. Vanessa Williams, I believe is her name. Looks fucking amazing. She’s like 56 in this movie.

She looks younger than I do.

Erick: Yeah. I thought that she was,

Vivi: My thought she can’t be that young. No, she looks so good. She looks

Erick: amazing. She looks exactly the same as it, the first

Vivi: one. She looks like she could be Anthony’s sister, not his mom.

Erick: she says it was because she wanted him to grow up happy and normal. And he’s like, but do I look normal though? Have you seen the fucking hive of bees that’s growing outta the side of my face? Well, it was

Vivi: designed to look like a honey

Erick: comb.

Yeah,

Vivi: if you have a, what is it? Tripophobia. Tripophobia. The fear of holes. Holes, yeah. Don’t watch this .

Erick: The damage from the bee sting is spreading to the side of his face. She fixes the story. He was told earlier about Helen saying she actually saved him from the fire.

When a Candyman wanted him to be one of his victims, they all vowed never to speak Candy Man’s name again, but someone broke the pact. Anthony clearly knows it was William and goes back to the projects.

Vivi: I think it would be incredibly difficult to have a pact with so many [00:46:00] people. You know, someone’s gonna slip up.

Erick: Yes. . Especially the kids. Cause I was like the adults. I don’t know. Especially after something so traumatizing happens. Yeah.

Vivi: I feel like it would be kept quiet for a while, but yes, eventually for

Erick: sure. The kids would be the ones who would bring it back. Kids say everything.

Yeah. and Troy go back to their apartment to pick up her things, but she finds it suspicious that he’s not there. She sees a pen from the laundromat and makes her way over. I would not assume that at all. I would immediately. Right. That’s like if I went into the kitchen, you, you were gone. I’d be like, wow.

A bank pen. I gotta go to the bank. . mean, I get it. She’s like, he met the William dude at the laundromat, so fuck my comment. But just stupid to remember it. . Yeah. She gets suspicious when she sees Anthony’s beanie on William’s desk. , but gets kidnapped immediately by William . We get a flashback from William’s childhood where his sister and her friend’s, some in Candyman.

He opens the door to find them dead and looks up to see Sherman looking back at him in the mirror. we come back to present day, William, as he says, they now have a witness. Brandon set up in a church as we hear William making a call to the cops saying that say my name killer is in cab.

Killing [00:47:00] people. It’s revealed that William summon Candyman as payback for kicking them out so they could move back in. Candyman can kill their fathers, their sisters, their babies. Now Anthony’s turned around to reveal he’s in even worse shape. This scene is interesting because you are not sure if he’s under a spell.

Yeah. Is he actually turning into the Candyman now? Is he drugged by William? Mm-hmm. , I think it’s the latter. will cuts his arm off right in front of Brianna and all Anthony does is watch an emotionless, but Obvious Pain.

Vivi: This is another one of those, I think I’ve mentioned House of Wax. Mm-hmm. in quite a few movies, but the single tier and the pain and not being able to do anything reminds me

Erick: a lot of that. Yeah. the like. groaning under your vo. Yeah. Cause he can’t even like let out a cry. It’s just in your chest. He says, Anthony’s story will be that he was an artist who lost his mind and cops just shot him down without question. I think it’s that line that I’m like, William’s motive, like, it makes sense. He ends up saying that like, the reason he does it is because, their community was getting screwed over both naturally and by Candyman in [00:48:00] this lore.

And so he’s like, we are kicked out. They’ve pretty much gotten rid of our community. They decide to move in and gentrify it and there’s nothing fucking them over. I think I’m gonna give them some of what we got. And so he wants to send ’em in Candyman. The part where I think it’s weird is what makes him attack Anthony.

Why wouldn’t this just naturally happen? One, because it was already seeming to happen

Vivi: Right? Because all the killings are being associated with his artwork. So I think eventually he was gonna be a suspect and he’s acting

Erick: really sketchy.

And the unfortunate result in that storyline is that like we expect society and the police to,

Vivi: to do what they do

Erick: in this movie. Yeah. But why uh, force it on Anthony instead of being like, let me just do it.

Vivi: He was tied to Candyman. He would’ve ended up in this situation, probably regardless. Just with Troy telling him the urban legend in the first place.

Mm-hmm. . But I think he was just in it to give him the final look. Yeah. Because, you know, otherwise, how would’ve Anthony gotten to that point?

Did he have to He was already looking Pretty creepy with the bee st. Poisoning him.

Erick: I would’ve honestly been okay with like, his arm fell off, his arm fucking [00:49:00] fell off and just fell off from all the poison. Yeah. Cuts herself loose with a pen and runs off. While William points out the siren’s approaching, he pulls out some candies and yells for Brianna to come back before we hear him. Obviously cut up by candies that he shoves in his mouth that we can only imagine have razor blades in them. Oh, does he?

When he goes and finds Brianna later, his mouth’s all bloody. Mm-hmm. if that’s wrong let me know the, clarification.

William Chases Brianna through some sort of underground corridor that leads to the projects.

They end up in the unit from the beginning where Brianna just stabs him over and over with the pen. Pretty much just ending William there. I do

Vivi: appreciate though that she. Gets the job done. Mm-hmm. . Yeah. She double, triple quadrupled

Erick: taps. That’s the way it’s done. Anthony stands at the door saying he thinks she’s dead before collapsing.

She screams for help as the sirens get closer. A cop barges in telling her to put her hands up and doesn’t even let her get a word out before pulling the trigger three times for a second. You think as the viewer, and I thought I did too, that he shot her and I was like, what

Vivi: the hell? I would’ve been pissed.

So would I if the movie ended like that?

Erick: for a [00:50:00] second I was thinking like, maybe they’re gonna go to the hell route and she’s candyman. But you learn that they actually shot Anthony in front of her.

More cops show up as they bring her out, handcuffed and put her in the backseat of a car. All the cops have this stupid judging look on their face. This cop gets in the front seat. he says they’d been looking for Anthony for a while and got a tip. He’d be there. He asks her to explain what happened, especially since Anthony attacked Officer Jones causing him to pull the trigger.

he says, if that doesn’t sound right to her, they can paint her as an accomplice. So he asks her to make a decision. Infuriating.

Yes. Brianna asks the cop to let her see herself in the mirror. He’s confused, but he lets her, and she says Candyman five times further confusing him. The music starts to ramp up too. She doesn’t say

Vivi: Candyman five times. She says it four times. Oh, I

Erick: thought she thought I was crazy. I thought I was crazy.

Mm-hmm. . Cause I was like, I definitely come to four, but I guess I’m an idiot.

Vivi: and the cop, then’s like Candy man. And then obviously that’s why he’s the one. Mm-hmm.

Erick: murdered. That’s when she looks relieved as the door is locked and a cop comes out from the unit with his neck cut open, the cops [00:51:00] outside unload their guns, but Candyman just cuts them down while the cop in the driver’s seat keeps trying to open the door, the cop asks who he is, and Candyman says, smoothly. I am the writing on the walls. I am the sweet smell of blood on the street. The buzz that echoes in the alleyways, they will say, I shed innocent blood. You are far from innocent, but they will say you were.

That’s all that matters. The whole time Anthony is walking around the cop car as we get glimpses of the candy men through history in his reflection.

Vivi: This narration is done by Tony Todd, correct? No, no. That is Anthony’s voice, yes. Okay.

Erick: Cause it’s definitely different. his voice is

Vivi: different in this narration.

thought, I think

Erick: they just raised the base.

But they replicated mm-hmm. , the, the way that Tony talks to him in the first candyman, the booming deep version.

So the whole time this scene is going on, the flashing blue lights are in your face. And I’ll be honest, it made me feel the way I feel when I see them in real life now. I’m not taking away from. this movie and the scene. But I just wanna say that I thought it was interesting how it’s, done on purpose, right?

It is. Absolutely. These lights are flashing in our face.

Vivi: the first time we watched it, we watched, you [00:52:00] know, all the lights out and whatever. And it is disorienting and you can barely focus on what is happening. And I’m sure it’s meant to replicate how people in this situation feel. Mm-hmm. in that

Erick: moment.

The cop gets out and runs into an alley. Brianna makes her way over to sea and manages to get a glimpse of Tony. Todd’s candyman. Daniel finishing the cop off as he hovers covered in the swarm of bees. I do like how Mortal Combat esque Candyman looks hovering covered in the swarm of bees from like Yeah.

Head to chest or whatever. He looks at her and he says, tell everyone, and it’s Tony Todd’s face before we cut to the credits. do stick through the credits. I’ve said it already, really sad to see the rest of these stories, but it ends with all of them standing in a line you know, making a stand as candyman for what is to come or not at all. But it is cool. That kind of leaves it open-ended.

Why is this movie so good though? ?

Vivi: I loved the ending of this now, so we were gonna talk about it, so we’re gonna talk about it. I don’t think you need it to Anytime. Anytime a movie ages down an actor with cgi.

[00:53:00] It does not look good. It just doesn’t, it looks terrible. I hated it when they did it in um, it, chapter two. I didn’t like it in this cuz again, maybe I personally wouldn’t have any issues with Tony Todd Aging. I’m sure he still looks pretty good. Yeah. He’s also covered in the swarm of bees. You know, I don’t think it was

Erick: necessary.

No. And I mean, you could have done the practical route, and he doesn’t look bad. I mean, he’s gonna be at the Salem Horror Fest and they sent that email out recently. Mm-hmm. with his picture and I’m like, he looks fine.

Vivi: So like, you’re like, oh my God. Excited that you see the original Candyman, but then you’re like, oh, he looks really weird.

Erick: CGI id, his teeth look weird. Right? Yeah. Like his mouth is animated weirdly. . I will say, honestly, I was waiting for one of those candyman, at least to be,

Vivi: to be him. Yeah. I was waiting for him to show up in that last scene. So, yeah, too glad it happened was not a fan of the cgi.

Erick: agreed.

Totally agree. But no, hey, this, movie was awesome.

Vivi: I really loved this movie. We watched it a month ago when we decided we were gonna cover it, and I watched it right before recording, and I was still like, enthralled by everything that was happening.

I think I [00:54:00] appreciate the expansion of the lore that’s happening. I think it was a smart choice from the director’s standpoint. I think there is some amazing shots in this film. I think it’s beautifully done. I love the showing of all the artwork. The music is just like, again, a character within itself and I think this is done really well.

I don’t know if DeCosta has plans to ever direct horror again now that she’s like, seems to be going in like the Marvel route, but like I would gladly watch anything else she puts out.

It does a great job of, I think you mentioned earlier, being a love letter to the original.

I think it absolutely is. It has those Easter eggs for fans of the first film. Again, didn’t see of Candyman two and three, but overall, truly enjoy this experience and I am only gonna deduct a half point for horrible CGI at the end . So to me, this movie’s at 9.5, outta 10, dang. Very high, No, I really loved it. I think it’s probably gonna be in my top 10. Damn. Okay. Because I really enjoy the first Candyman as well.

Erick: is the first one top 10 for you?

Vivi: Maybe again, it’s just so [00:55:00] much that works for me. I think it’s truly the music that just doesn’t,

Erick: right? ? Yeah. It’s the vibes. And the vibes.

Are there I think it’s really good too. think that the story going, the direction it did with adding so much more meaning to the candyman persona and you already think that the original Candyman story is like fucked up.

Vivi: It’s a tragic

Erick: love story. Yeah. I also like to, See the Candyman character in this light, at least as like an anti-hero. And as a comic book fan, I like an anti-hero story. the whole, like, they’re gonna think you’re innocent but we all know you’re not. That kind of thing. Fuck yeah, dude. Kill people who deserve it.

Don’t do it. Actually don’t do it

Vivi: in movies. In movies. Do it in movies.

Erick: I thought that the movie was gonna be just your run of the mill reek wool remake you type that kind of makes things up again and doesn’t really care about the original.

But no, this, did really good it feels longer than an hour and a half because it’s just full of things that happen in a chain of events, right? Yes. There’s never really like a lull in the movie. I agree.

Vivi: Cuz usually we’re like, this movie’s too long.

Why did it need that scene? I feel like you could have drawn out the [00:56:00] last scene a little bit more though. Like I, I would’ve liked to see more, but I do feel like it ended on a perfect

Erick: note. . It’s beautifully shot. Music’s great. I also think I give it a, I don’t even have a reason to give it anything less than a 10. nothing in it made me think this sucks.

Vivi: Yeah. There was never a moment other than the CGI where I was like, Why is this here or why did they do this this

Erick: way?

You know, even the cgi, I was just having to see Tony . Yeah. Too. You know that

Vivi: Are we just fan boys over this?

again, did not grow up with these movies so, the original first three films.

We only recently saw it and it’s kind of like, damn, I wish I could have seen this. Sooner cuz I think then I would also have that added layer of like, nostalgia

Erick: for it. . That’s true. I think growing up I stayed away from it because my cousins would just fuck with us so much. When I say my cousins fucked with us so much about Candyman, I avoided playing the game.

Candy Land. I thought the board game Candy Land was associated with Candyman and you’re like, and you played Candy Land.

Candyman would show

Vivi: up , you’re like, you’re not gonna get me to say it in this board game. . Yeah.

Erick: You said it was

Vivi: child’s play? [00:57:00] Yeah, for us it was Chucky because you know, oh also takes place in Chicago. It was always like Chucky was gonna get you. That’s why he does. I do hate dolls but I like Chucky now

Erick: that I’m older I’m gonna get you good guy and see Planet.

If I get a good guy. Prop, would you be down to put him in our room? Just kidding. . Only if you go to Tiffany

Vivi: as well. I like Tiffany. we’d put it back there

Erick: somewhere. Fun fact, when I was a kid I thought Tiffany was hot. Mm.

Vivi: That does not surprise me. The doll or ? . Jennifer Tilly. Tilly. Yeah. Jennifer Tilly.

Okay. Thank you for clarifying .

Erick: But also the doll cause but also . Cause I was a child. now that we’ve covered it, let us know what you think in the comments

Vivi: say, what did we miss?

What Easter eggs. Cuz I’m sure we missed some details cuz this feels like a film that’s heavy in Easter eggs.

Erick: You said there was a ton of fun facts and I’m sure we didn’t even like touch the surface. Yeah, but let’s talk about what scared Loki or Ripley in this case.

Vivi: Yeah. So I watched this film right before recording and the opening scene where, Sherman comes out of the walls.

It’s a scene where the music’s building and it’s like this great reveal. Ripley’s a funny dog that actually watches tv. Loki sometimes [00:58:00] watches tv, but he’ll like stop paying attention. Ripley will pay attention for like a good few minutes and then go back to watching it. So she was like watching it and I swear the music was building and I could feel her getting like antsy and then like, it like showed Sherman and she was like freaking out.

Like she didn’t know where to go. Oh no. I kind of felt bad. I went to go sit with her afterwards. I’m like, I’m sorry. You should recorded it. I tried to, but it was more like, this is mean because

Erick: she’s so afraid. it is mean. Yeah. do you wanna tell us about it?

Ripley?

Vivi: All right. I’m sorry, Ripley, but we’re gonna watch a lot of horror movies in this house.

Erick: I can already see her awkward face.

Vivi: But does that pretty much wrap it up for us

Erick: here tonight? It does. I am going to start to add our patrons here because thanks to them, we have made it to two years, so we really appreciate you. Thank you all for being here and hanging out with us,

Vivi: as always. We hope you guys had a good time here with us.

You could follow us pretty much anywhere at Shaken, not Scared, except Twitter. Twitter Shaken Scared Pod. [00:59:00] You could send us an email at shaken not scared. Pod gmail.com. I forgot to say Pod, didn’t I? No,

Erick: you’re good. Oh, okay. . So we’re the show on Patreon. We have a bunch of episodes over there, so make sure not to miss out.

Listen, wherever we get your podcast, give us a follow out. Check out our drink videos. If you’re watching this on YouTube, make sure to like and subscribe Okay, thanks. Bye bye.

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