Vivi: well, drink it. Iced. It’s fine.
Erick: Iced punchy.
Well, are you ready? Hilarious. Yeah. What? the way you said it to
Vivi: It sounds like. Uh, Starbucks refresher tea or something?
Erick: at that point it’ll be iced, punchy, iced pound, Che ice ponchos
Erick: Will come back to the shake and it scared podcast shots of whore. Number three, we’re diving in the Lord behind some of the movies we’ve covered, horrifying stories we’ve been covered. And just anything outright creepy here with you as always your host, Eric and Bebe today. We’re talking about grandpa’s in the vampire reap is Wayne Bowden, but before we get into that, all right, maybe
Vivi: I am. In a weird limbo right now. It’s almost Christmas. Like
Vivi: the last two weeks of the year is just a non-existent time before.
Erick: It’s like the Sunday scaries, but to the max. At least that’s how I feel. Cause I just get really depressed. Festivities being over it’s like another nine months before something exciting happens.
Vivi: Not really.
Not for us. We got a lot of exciting stuff planned for January and February
Erick: go listen to it, go watch it. Whatever we’re coming up with, make sure that you find it.
Vivi: And if you have any suggestions for our anniversary episode, where all yours
Erick: Well, do you want to dive into this?
Vivi: let’s fucking
I will be covering the Wayne boat in case, and Eric will be covering Krampus. I will probably be going first, just so we can end on a lighter note. true crime stuff. Isn’t our typical content. So I just want to give that warning out there that if this isn’t the type of stuff you like to listen to, you could probably skip ahead to the Krampus portion of the episode. This case does deal with topics of sexual.
Okay, let’s talk Wayne Bowden, the believed in SPO for black Christmas, although there is multiple, this is just the one that I was able to find more research on. I mainly gathered my information from good old Wikipedia and good old murder.
Erick: Oh, that’s the thing.
It’s a thing. Nice.
Vivi: Montreal, 1967. It is booming. what? Why are you already laughing? So
Erick: in the scene, booming music, stumping
Vivi: crime is happening.
Erick: People are in the parking lot, bumping. I mean, maybe.
How else has Montreal in 1967?
Vivi: I think we pretty much set the scene on that one. But
along with the influx of new residents to the city of Montreal comes a rise in crime. This is something that just kind of happens when cities start to become more populated. The following year in July of 1968, the body of Norma V in court, a 21 year old school teacher was found in her apartment. after she had failed to show up for work, when detectives arrived on the scene, they discovered her body. She had been strangled and rape her body bore some vicious bite marks on her breasts, a detail that the police decided not to release to the public. Unfortunately, this case didn’t really go anywhere.
Some people of interest were interviewed, but eventually. The investigators had a dead. And that was until October of 1969. when a woman named Shirley Odette was found dead at the rear of an apartment complex, she was fully clothed and her body was found at the bottom of the fire escape.
The manner of death wasn’t readily apparent to the first responders on the scene. However, further investigation uncovered that Shirley had been strangled and raped and had also had her breasts mutilated with bite marks.
Erick: Mutilated. So like
Vivi: Bain apart. Yeah. There was some descriptions that went as far as to say that they were not on, it was not a good scene.
This is not something that I would
Erick: ever want to see.
Vivi: It was also noted that Shirley did not have any skin or cells under her fingernails, meaning that people thought she might’ve known her attacker and didn’t have a chance to actually fight back. Once again, the investigation on this kind of led nowhere. But not even a month later in November, a jewelry clerk named Marielle art Combolt finished work and left with a man. She told coworkers that the name of this mystery man was bill Her coworkers noted that she seemed really entranced by this man the next day.
However, Marielle did not show up for work. Her employer actually called her landlady went to investigate Marielle’s apart. Unfortunately, she found Marielle’s lifeless body fully clothed on the couch.
She also had been raped in. Once again, there were bite marks on the breast of the victim, and there didn’t seem to be much of a struggle in the apartment. Her bra and panty hose had been ripped, but the apartment itself looked to be an order. Now this is the third victim that police have seen.
they’re starting to put together that this might be a pattern. They might be looking for the same man, by the
Erick: third time, by the third
Vivi: time, why not? Because I think it takes three kills to be considered a serial killer in the first place, but his emo. I don’t know how unique it is. I don’t know how many cases there could be with this.
I just thought
Erick: second nature. I’m tired of police. Cause if I see, oh, look, a person was murdered and all their feet were cut off. And then I find a second one and like, oh, it’s not that far away from the first one. And the feet were also cut off. I’d immediately be like, oh, probably related question.
Vivi: Mark might be the same person. I don’t know.
Erick: We got to wait for the third one. Sorry
Vivi: to confirm.
But this victim at least gave detectives a name bell. I found this Joe. Online that I’ve found in poor taste, but it was like if you met a young woman in a bar and you said your name was bill, you didn’t have a hope in hell of taking that girl home.
I’m like, oh, I’m so sorry for you. What? There’s people being murdered? Bill?
Erick: Them. So people were just making jokes about it.
Vivi: I mean, Apparently men named bill or making jokes about this
Erick: isn’t that against them
Vivi: though, I would not be making any
Vivi: poor days. Didn’t appreciate it. Yeah. But in January of 1978, a woman named Jean way would become the final victim of the vampire rapist in Montreal. Jean’s boyfriend had actually come to pick her up at her apartment for their scheduled date, but when he arrived and knocked on Jean’s door, she didn’t answer thinking that she was still getting ready.
He headed off to the local bar to give her a couple more minutes. When he returned and continued to knock, he actually realized that the door was unlocked. He let himself in and discover.
Jean’s body laying naked on her bed, Okay. So here’s the thing. There was some conflicting notes about this. There are some that said that she did have bite marks on her breast. And there are some sources that say that she did not have bite marks either way.
The hypothesis is that the boyfriend actually arrived too early while the killer was in the process of committing the crime. So her not having bite mark. Indicated that he didn’t get to finish and he was scared off by him, but again, conflicting.
Erick: Oh, am I special relation? Was that it was the boyfriend and he’s trying to say it was the killer,
Vivi: Huh? Because without bite marks, how would you know, to tie the crimes together?
Erick: Yeah. Without being able to say, oh, well he strangled and mutilated. It could’ve just been anybody, or. And the said that it was this other thing
Vivi: that sucks though.
Cause like if you’re the boyfriend, you’re looking a little sass and put also you came in and found something super traumatic. If you didn’t do this and you might have been able to stop it, but you just didn’t go in. That would suck too. Either way I would hate to be this boyfriend was all fucked though.
He is not having a good time either way.
Once again, though police came to a dead end in this investigation, it was at this point where Wayne boated had relocated from Montreal to Calgary in may of 1971. In Calgary, his final victim would be a 33 year old high school teacher named Elizabeth Ann Portis, who did not report to work on the morning of May 18th, 1971.
Her apartment manager was called with undiscovered, discovered her body on the bedroom floor. Parties had been raped and strangled and her breasts were likewise mutilated with bite marks. amid the wreckage. However, the police discovered a broken cufflink under the victim’s body, which was one of the first clues that would lead them to Wayne Bowden in their investigation.
They discovered that two of her colleagues actually saw the man who was picking her up for a date that night riding in a blue Mercedes-Benz. They noted that the car had a very decent. Bullhead decal on it. The coworkers did remember that his name was bill and they described him as a flashy dresser with neat short hair. at this point we could probably guess why. A lot of people thought this case inspired by Christmas bill obviously is the killer and black Christmas and silent night, deadly night and gremlins and gremlins.
He murdered all those people, the gremlins didn’t I know it. The following day, May 19th, the blue Mercedes was spotted by the scene of the crime. You know, that thing of how. Killers often in return to the scene of the crime to relive the crime.
Erick: It seems like the most idiotic thing to do.
Vivi: I mean, I guess that speaks just to the narcissism of a killer, thinking you’re never going to get caught and wanting to relive.
What you did. The thing is, this is exactly the next day. I don’t even think it’s like died down enough yet. They’re probably still active and they were actively investigating the scene.
Erick: He hadn’t even showered, probably followed his scent the whole way.
Vivi: Yes. The policemen are actually part dog.
Bowden was arrested half an hour later as he was walking to his car, he told police in the midst of this questioning that he had actually just moved from Walter yall a year ago.
Obviously tying him to the first four murders. He admitted that he had been dating Elizabeth and was with her the night of the murder. However, he claims that he left her at home and she was perfectly fine when he left
Erick: again, suspicious boyfriend ends up being the.
Vivi: I don’t know if it was a full boyfriend yet. If they were just on a couple of dates, still suspicious, obviously suspicious,
Erick: suspicious as fuck. The moment he says, will you be my girlfriend suspicious? What does he want
When they presented the broken cuff link to him, he admitted that it was his why this man I think was just ready to. Get caught.
It was discovered that Bowden was a former fashion model okay. Who cares? If he was a fashion model,
Erick: I was going to ask
Vivi: questions I think it only ties into him being a flashy dress.
I’ve looked it up. This man is not that good looking.
Erick: That was your question. Just like, cause he looks good.
Vivi: I don’t know because there’s so many people who would say like Ted Bundy was a good looking man. I do not think Ted Bundy was a good lookout. He was like, shit.
And he was shit. So, you know
I didn’t investigate the killer that much because I hate when it’s glorified, when we talk about their. Who are they? I mean, don’t get me wrong. It’s interesting. Right. It’s the whole thing of nature versus nurture. But I also feel like you remember every detail of the killer’s lives and then you forget what happened to the victims, which I am just not a fan of.
Erick: Yeah, no, I agree. What made him select these specific victims and do it.
Vivi: possibly that they were all living alone.
Most of these women were killed near or in their apartments. again, pointing out the similarities to black Christmas, where they are sorority girls. It seems like they’re dating. They have their own lives, they have their own jobs. they’re kind of independent. And he just hates women, possibly isn’t them boobs for some reason, or he likes them too much.
Erick: I can’t imagine what makes you just wake up one day and you’re like, yeah. Those things, those things that hang from chests, those are the things that I want to eat. Cause it was like cannibal.
Vivi: Eat the flesh. I
Erick: mean, when you’re mute, leading them imagine that’s like enjoyable, it’s not uh,
Vivi: too far off to say you’re almost there to cannibal.
Right? Who knows his crimes were definitely escalating. I think if he wasn’t caught, he had the potential for that, but I don’t know. That’s speculation. The look on Eric’s face is just discussing. And question
Erick: like, because what led him to this? Like, I’ve never been so into something that I’m like, let me go and point to the shit out of it. I’m gonna go bite low-key right now. I love dark so much. Like bite Loki’s face off.
Vivi: right. Calm down, Michael.
I guess I made a mistake. Researching more of his background.
Erick: I mean, no, we don’t need no more. I’m just speculating here. Like what leads
Vivi: to that?
Anyway? I mean, not good things I assume.
Erick: Right? Modeling,
Erick: I’m glad we caught him.
Vivi: I would argue we did not.
Erick: Well, I said we could’ve caught them at two, but the cows want to play games.
Vivi: The rule is three. That’s always the rule of three.
Just kidding. You will definitely be arrested if you murder one person.
Erick: Right. Two is already too many Yeah,
Vivi: I would argue one is too many.
Erick: I would argue even thinking
Vivi: about it is too many. You’ve done enough. So.
The police in Calgary were actually able to hold boat and on suspicious. Of Elisabeth’s murder due to a photograph that was recovered and Mariel’s place. She actually had a photograph of bill, the man that she was going out with that night, police just hadn’t been able to connect that photo to anyone they knew in her life. But when they arrested Bowden, they realized that he had a striking resemblance to the man in the photo.
with enough grounds to hold him, police then turn their attention to the bite marks on the victim’s breasts. Now, remember this was a detail that was never released to the public and Bowden’s case is actually the first case to be convicted in north America based on Odonto logical evidence. So
teeth marks Once he was convicted on those charges, he actually confessed to the rest of the murders. And that was enough to sentence him for three life sentences.
but that is the alleged inspo for black Christmas. And I can see a lot of the parallels. Especially with the. And his type of victims and the way that he killed them.
Erick: I’m wondering why people would disagree that this is actually it, because like we said, Nick Mancusos, who is the voice of Billy says that no, there’s actually this other 14 year old kid had killed his family, but that seems less likely, but.
Vivi: Is it just that thing of like, based on a true story, it makes it scarier, but we’re going to keep it like vague. So you don’t actually know what story, cause we might be fricking line
I feel like all movies now just say based on a true story, I need evidence. Do you have evidence of grandpa’s
Erick: evidence of Krampus? I didn’t go too deep into several of the different versions. Yes it is. But I lied We all know St. Nicholas, the patrons seem to children, but not many know of his evil counterparts around the world. The grandpas may be increasing in popularity, but others include hunts. Trump of France, a rich man who worships Satan in life, stealing all of his wealth from the people around him.
He was banished by the Pope and stripped of everything. He had isolated in the mountains. He began to hunger for the flesh children. He dresses a scarecrow, snuck up and kill the 10 year old boy. And before he could eat him was struck down by God. Now kids are warned of Hans trap, who goes around, looking for children to eat during Christmastime.
Vivi: A couple of thoughts here. One, I like how he just went straight for craving some human flesh.
Erick: I mean, I don’t know the full story, but that’s kind of the way it is. It’s like he was isolated. And so he went into madness and was like, I want the flesh of children
Vivi: now in isolation, you don’t crave chocolate.
Erick: I mean, you don’t crave boobs.
Vivi: Maybe he did, but you say which hips or chips?
Erick: Oh, crave chocolate or which hips? Yes. That sounds full glory. Yeah.
Vivi: struck down by God. Wow. Small it. How does it feel to be God’s favorite kid? What do you mean? This is God’s straight up intervene.
Erick: That’s true. But that season knows that we’re like, why did God decide to do it? After he had already killed the kid? when God decided that the abomination of eating this child was too much, he said, fuck you hunted strap.
But it was like, so killing the kid, wasn’t enough kidnapping this child, killing him, cutting up into pieces and putting them into this. You didn’t strike him down any of that time. So you mean to tell
Vivi: me this man was preparing this stew
Erick: and right before he took the bite is when God’s struggled.
Vivi: decided to draw the line right there.
I’m going to make you do all the hard work of cooking, but you’re not going to eat it.
Erick: And then I’m gonna give you the job of going around, like scaring kids during Christmas.
Vivi: So. Did he get his dream job?
Erick: I don’t know. I mean, if they’re bad, he gets to eat
So I guess, yeah, I guess this kind of just works out for him. Nevermind. That kid is not God’s favorite.
Erick: No, I don’t know the lesson there. It’s like, well, he was smiled at him to save the kid, but also he runs a muck during Christmas time. If you’re bad. So there’s a couple others, barefoot tarred, also a France.
When three kids were lost in Lorraine, France, they encountered a butcher asking him to give them somewhere to stay for the night. He killed the kids and put them on sale. It’s pickled him and his shop. Same thing Liz found out about this, went to the butcher’s place and revived the kids a miracle to punish pairs St. Nick tied him to his donkey with the job to punish naughty kids by whipping them from there on out. I don’t know how that’s a punishment. You killed those kids. So now I’m going to punish you forever to punish kids. Again,
Vivi: these people are just getting their dreams
Erick: of point is not just to punish 90 kids, but to punish them until they’re good.
Vivi: Huh? That sounds like a lot of work. Maybe it’s not a dream job.
Erick: I mean, that’s why it’s punishment. Right. But also, I just don’t understand the whole full circle. It’s like you were going to kill a kid, but also it’s your job now to scare kids and almost murder them if you get them.
Just doesn’t seem like a responsible way to handle this situation.
Erick: There’s also belts, Nicole. The story is that he used to drag 90 children out into the forest to never be returned. It wasn’t all bad and would offer them ways to be forgiven by making them dancing or do other tricks. Lot like Saint Nicholas bells, Nicole brings gifts for good children and uses a switch to punish the bad.
He’s allegedly the first thing, Christmas history to have done something like this before Santa allegedly had list. he also lets himself be known unlike Santa, who brings gifts while you’re sleeping
Vivi: creep. So this guy.
Erick: Will you good. Would you bet here I am. They want a gift where you, oh, you were bad.
Okay. You’re just going to be whipped bud.
Vivi: First of all, a lot of these are like really into just hitting children.
At least he’s uh, it sounds like a more consensual version of Santa. Cause he doesn’t know, just
Erick: wait until you’re asleep. Apparently he just like knocks on your door and he’s like, Hey, I’m here. That’s actually very courteous. Good or bad. Be honest. I might kidnap you and take you to the horse and then make you sing dance or do other tricks or give you a
Vivi: murder weapon.
Erick: No, he will murder weapon. You. Until you’re good. I’m just kidding. he’s not powerful. Dard from France.
Vivi: He’s not that other asshole.
Erick: Okay. back to grandpa’s. So he is a pagan origin, and while the Catholic church tried to ban him, he’s been changed to be opposite to Saint Nicholas while still being a friend of his.
So, I think people will often assume that because he’s opposites like evil versus good, but they have a consensus. Relationship. It’s like we both worked together to punish or gifted kids. His name comes from the word cramping, which means claw and is believed to be the son of hell of Norris mythology.
Erick: fun. He’s a lot like the devil was shown as half go half man, often depicted wearing furs and rags, a bearded face covered in such a long tongue. Sometimes has a mask. That’s a call-out back to the Krampus when facts and devils. He can also be seen carrying chains, a stick or whip to punish children in a sack containing treats for well-behaved children or symbolic items meant to warn those who misbehave.
Kids go. they check to see if St. Nick left the gift or they could have been left warnings from grandpas that were like, bitch, you were almost bad.
So here’s a warning. So you don’t continue to be bad.
Vivi: At least he gives a warning.
Erick: Well, the next time he can be like, I’m gonna beat your ass.
Vivi: Let’s still warning.
Erick: The sex is also used for carrying children away to be taken out. That escalated quickly. some of these things I write about, it’s like, it depends on which iteration of Krampus you kind of look into.
in the 12th century, we can see traces of Krampus. Or other versions of him. So like Belsnickel and grandpas can often be interchanged apparently.
Next Ruprecht It’s another folkloric figure that when I was looking into neck root pecked, immediately, it was like, this is another name for Krampus.
A lot of the story deviated So I was like, I don’t know that this is actually grandpas,
okay. he travels with Saint Nicholas the day before St. Nicholas’s day, but has also accompanied other saints in the past, including St. Peter and St. Martin under the name, Nick. Other areas of Germany had them following Chris Kindle, also known as the Christ child or baby Jesus.
See, there is a Yule baby. I
Vivi: knew it. I wouldn’t call him that
Erick: picture. A you’ll baby. Nope, Jesus. Isn’t a UL baby.
He’s celebrated on campus knocked December 5th, the night before St. Nicholas. in some parts of central and Eastern Europe, including Germany, Austria, and Czech Republic, people, dresses, campus scare children and exchange compost carton, or cranberries cards.
Modern celebrations include Krampus love or Krampus runs where people get drunk, dresses, Krampus, and chase others through the streets. Apparently some city, as much as 35,000 people would join in on like a Krampus
Vivi: run, I’ve seen photos of this. could you imagine being a parent and your kid has been an asshole?
And you’re like, I can’t wait to dress up and just scare the crap out of my kid on December.
Erick: What I’m hearing is we need to start making you what on iron’s thing?
Vivi: That’s real scary though. I think it would be more scared of Krampus ballerina.
Erick: It’d be harder to run though. Cause you’re wearing a dress and avail.
You just tripped my
Vivi: is in front of you the whole time.
Erick: While the Catholic church tried to get rid of any traces of Krampus, because he was deemed too, unreligious there in the early 19 hundreds, he’s made a resurgence over the last few decades and a lot of European countries in the U S posing as an opposite to everything that is jolly about Christmas.
Some believe that this is because many have grown tired from all the commercialism surrounding Christmas, but others are worried that Krampus is headed in the same direction.
Vivi: In the beginning. You said that Krampus isn’t super well-known. I think he’s definitely Ben and a lot of pop culture stuff.
There’s very specifically, I’m thinking about. American dead had an episode about Krampus. There’s the movie we just covered, but there is like so many movies, so many movies after that one that came
Erick: out with crane
Vivi: I love how the opposite of oh, Christmas is so commercial lies is we need to beat and terrified these children.
Erick: Dresses potentially Satan.
Vivi: I mean, that’s one
Erick: way to go.
I also read another thing that said that he’s possibly just combination of different goat figures in history. Like if he is neck respect, he’s an adaptation of Odin. He could be a different iteration of one of the two goats of Thor, he can be an iteration of the figure that brings winter. he could be a lot of things and it’s just funny that it just has come to be this character but that’s all I got on Krampus. I think it was a cool story.
I’d like to learn more, a little bit about the other characters,
one of them was a female.
Vivi: was she? The holiday, which, I think I saw something similar story-wise she’s like the opposite of Saint Nicholas. I think she has a issue from Italy.
I’m not sure where, but it was definitely a European. Folklore.
Erick: Gotcha. There’s also like the 13 you’ll Lance heard them. No. They’re like Dorf type of characters that go around fucking shit up, but also gifting kids.
Vivi: No, no, yes. I think I have heard about this.
Erick: They brought them up as like a scary story and I was like, oh, I’ve only ever seen positive stuff and put the 13 year old lads. There’s also the old cat. Oh my
Vivi: God. I just love that.
All these folklores are terrifying. Yeah. Like everything’s a cautionary
Erick: tale. I wish we had a lot of that back there. Just so much more interesting.
Vivi: I think that’s just called true crime now.
Erick: No, I want you all. Cat story is not, I
Vivi: want supernatural,
Erick: grandpa’s is great. He seems all right. Yeah, he seems cool. He’s got morals. He leaves warnings. He doesn’t automatically punish you, but he could eat you. He can take you in a sack
Vivi: I mean, buddy Warren do so. It’s fine. He warned
Erick: you last year.
Vivi: So you had time to improve.
Erick: But also he’s got treats. So,
Vivi: you know, pros
Erick: and cons. If that’s not enticing, I don’t know what.
Vivi: Does that wrap things up for us here? It
Vivi: happy new year.
I know. Actually by the time of release you might be all Christmas doubt. So
Erick: I don’t know that I want to do Christmas all month and Thanksgiving all month in the future, because it’s,
Vivi: it’s just some, don’t get me wrong. I’ve had fun doing Christmas drinks and covering some Christmas movies that we haven’t seen.
Let us know. Do you like the theme months? Is it too much? you just don’t want to think about the holidays? Yeah. We hope it’s a really fun new year’s for you guys. Avenir happy new year, you can follow us pretty much anywhere. And chicken nuggets, scared pod except Twitter, Twitter shaken, scared pod. You can send us an email at shaken nuts, scared firstname.lastname@example.org.
Erick: You can support the show on patriarch. We’ve got different things on there. You can get access to One more episode and one more drink per month. You can listen to us on all your favorite podcasting sites, apple podcast, Spotify, Google, Stitcher, a bunch of others.
Give us a listen, give us a follow go like or drink videos, send Loki some happy new year treats.
Vivi: Be sure to like rate, review all that good stuff and happy new year. I’m an air.
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